Messed Up Sounds, Please HELP

AaronD

Active Member
Ok so I cannot get rid of the noise but as you have recommended I turned down the volume of my tracks and the capture card to -60dB and now it's no longer audible. I'm not sure if this is going to be a problem but I'm very thankful for helping me. That noise was really getting on my nerves xD so thanks again!
It's generally good practice anyway to have everything turned off, turned all the way down, muted, disabled, etc., that you're not using right at this moment. Just in case one of them decides to misbehave.

Kinda like a live music festival only has the specific mics on that are being used for each song. If someone knocks over an unused mic while the sound guy is looking at something else, it just clatters on the stage and doesn't make a loud bang in the PA. If things are going well enough for me to watch for it, I'll even mute the second or two of handling noise as a mic is passed from one person to another, or gets taken off the stand or put back on.

If you never use the "rogue source" anyway, then you can just have it off and not care. I've had wireless mic receivers that like to misbehave when their mics are turned off, guitars that insist on making noise when their musicians aren't holding them, etc. The mute button is very much your friend!
 
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AnimeBreaker

New Member
Thanks a lot. You explain versy well. Btw what's your background with OBS? If you don't mind I would ask you another question. For multiple days I have tried to solve my laggy gaming performance. Watched multiple youtube videos about this but I cannot solve it. Here's my log:

For example it says I need to turn off HAGS even though I had turned it off before and have restarted my computer at least 30 times since then...
 

AnimeBreaker

New Member
Here's a side by side comparison between the two
 

AaronD

Active Member
what's your background with OBS?
I've been a tech guy since I was maybe 12 or so, starting with the lyric slides in church. Then I taught myself sound in the youth group when nobody had a clue, and learned several ways to do both across several churches. I've done a few concerts and other gigs, and recently added live video to the mix. Hence OBS.

I get bored with the same old stuff "just working". My favorite gigs are last-minute well-supplied ideas. A combination of having good gear and knowing exactly how all of it works, what each thing does and doesn't do, etc., and having no idea what some of the important details are going to be until the moment of, and I build the rig on the spot and make it sing! Kinda like the time-lapse videos of building a Lego thing.

I've had a few mission trips that I call "guerilla concert tours", that were pretty much that, 2 to 5 times a day every day for a week, all in different locations that only our driver knows, and sometimes *he* doesn't even know until the last moment before we go there. With the entire band and drama cast doing setup too, we were typically around 10 minutes from dumping the bus's air brakes to the first note of a live song, which includes:
  • Finding power and running the extension cord.
  • Marking a makeshift stage with speaker stands.
  • Setting up the band and the rest of the system between the stands.
  • Line-checking everything.
  • Finding a good mixing location in the audience somewhere with my WiFi control laptop.
Often with the audience already there and watching us arrive and do all that! I wished I could have done that for another week on the back of each one of those, but the rest of the team was worn out.

---

As I said before, I don't do games. It's all live events with mics and cameras.

Here's another one of the rigs I built, for an independent youth center close to where I live:
6kW on the ceiling + 6kW of subs on the floor, all analog except for the jukebox computer and the hard drive recorder that's designed to work like a tape machine.

I LOVE a good analog rig! It does less than digital, but it feels like a much closer connection to the machine, and it makes you think. Instead of a digital rig's 4-band full-parametric EQ (frequency, gain at that frequency, amount of affected frequencies around it) and an independent compressor for every channel, that rig "only" has a semi-parametric EQ (freq & gain for 2 bands, the other 2 are gain only, the remaining parameters are fixed), and 8 compressors total to allocate wisely across 40 channels and 8 submixes. So the constant question is, "What *actually needs* a given bit of processing, instead of just slapping everything on everything?"
 

AaronD

Active Member
Here's a side by side comparison between the two
There's a spot of silence that starts at 0:17. Is it okay before then and not after, by the amount of that silence?

Again, I'm not a gamer, so with constant action and repetitive sound effects, I'm lost. They might as well have nothing to do with each other, even if they *are* synced correctly.
 

AnimeBreaker

New Member
Sounds like you've found a passion in your life and never let go. So props to you and very much respected fo build that amount of knowledge over the years. The Soundsystem/mixing part of music was never really my forte but I did learn drums, trumpet, piano and singing growing up. Some better than others :D
Yes you said before that you don't game but I thought you might know a solution anyways. The silent part stems from no game sound input, so it's normal. I will continue to find a solution by myself and also posted another question in this forum here. Again thank you for your continued support :)
 

AaronD

Active Member
The Soundsystem/mixing part of music was never really my forte but I did learn drums, trumpet, piano and singing growing up. Some better than others :D
I had some music lessons growing up too. Piano and trombone. Then we moved and never found a teacher.

But the musical background really helps to mix a song, even if I have no direct experience with any of the instruments. If different parts of the song need slightly different settings, I can "feel" where they're going and make that adjustment with them. Most of the time, I'm right, even if I've never heard the song before.

I hated theory in those traditional music lessons. I never made the connection between boring scales with wacky fingering, or the "beat machine" that my piano teacher had (stereo cassette tape: one track went to mono headphones, the other track told the machine when I should have pushed the big button, and it scored me on that), and the fun pieces that I brute-force memorized. But when I taught myself sound, I spent a lot of time looking up how to do it, how this or that gear worked both externally and internally, how the physics work, etc. It wasn't until years later that I realized that that's theory!

---

I've since made my own analog audio processors, and I'm presently beating my head against a wall with a completely custom digital one. Still a long time before I give up on that. Yes, I could take what someone else has done and run with it, but all of them have various problems for the project I want to use it for:
  • Too big of a buffer, to use the single-instruction-multiple-data design that a lot of processors have to greatly improve efficiency, but also creates too much latency. (record a chunk, process it all at once, and play it back out) Most of the time, that's not a problem - the "standard latency" through a professional PA is equivalent to about a forearm's length in air, or less - but for physical reasons, I want it to be less than a handbreadth. Including the converters' delay, that leaves me with practically one sample at a time: in, process, out.
  • Not enough channels on USB. Partly for debugging and partly for the actual use, I want to send a bunch of intermediate taps back to the PC to record and analyze. But all the free hobbyist libraries seem to be hardcoded for stereo only. So I need to figure out how to modify a liberal-licensed one of them to increase the channel count. Behringer's XR18 and X32 digital mixers have 18 and 32 channels on USB respectively, with no driver required, so I know it works.
  • Not enough bit depth. The free hobby stuff is hardcoded for 16-bit integer, which is more than plenty for casual playing around or making a relatively simple musical instrument out of it. It's also indistinguishable from analog if you're not doing any processing with it. But the pro standard is 24-bit conversion and at least 32-bit processing, often 64-bit for the fancier stuff, just to guarantee that the conversion is better than analog could ever hope to be from a purely physical standpoint, and that the roundoff error from all that processing still doesn't affect the 24-bit output. Thus, the entire digital system is perfect as far as the analog endpoints can tell, no matter how much it does in between. Behringer uses 24-bit converters, 40-bit internal processing, and 32-bit integer on USB in addition to the high channel count, so I know that works too.
OBS, by the way, uses 32-bit audio processing internally, so no worries about the supposed "problems of digital" in general. But the myriad of problems that come from a pile of band-aids on top of a good idea for its original single use, written by someone who didn't really understand digital audio but managed to make it work anyway...most of the time...makes it one of the more difficult systems for me to use. The devs know this, and they're in the early stages of figuring out what they want to replace it with, to be much more maintainable than what it is now.

In the meantime, I often recommend that people do all of their audio work *outside* of OBS, either in a DAW (Digital Audio Workstation - essentially a complete sound studio in one app, that is designed specifically to only do that) or in a physical console, and bring the final result into OBS as its only audio source at all, to pass through completely unchanged. That's the pro mindset anyway: audio and video are separate things to be processed separately, and brought together at the very last moment to send out.

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And when I get that custom digital audio processor working and in a few rigs, I want to do the same thing for video. One pixel at a time - in, process, out - for minimal latency (and a severe restriction on what can be done, because a lot of things require knowledge of neighboring pixels or even the entire frame, but what I'm thinking of doesn't need that)......and I think I'll also need to learn how to use an FPGA to make that work (Field-Programmable Gate Array, which is essentially a breadboard-on-a-chip for high-speed digital circuitry; the "program" is the connections between things, not a sequential list of instructions)......
 

konsolenritter

Active Member
often recommend that people do all of their audio work *outside* of OBS, either in a DAW (Digital Audio Workstation - essentially a complete sound studio in one app, that is designed specifically to only do that) or in a physical console, and bring the final result into OBS as its only audio source at all, to pass through completely unchanged. That's the pro mindset anyway: audio and video are separate things to be processed separately, and brought together at the very last moment to send out.

ACK, ACK, ACK, ACK, ACK and ACK. I forgot: ACK. So much truthness! Nailed to the point.

Never to forget: If something goes wrong live with the video path, there's still audio for the audience (except for if the whole OBS or encoder crashes). Short freeze or dropout of video is widely accepted by people since Corona video calls, as long as the audio persists and goes on. But dropouts in the audio world are terrible at all. So i do separate audio and video for the very same reasons.
 
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konsolenritter

Active Member
Thanks a lot. You explain versy well. Btw what's your background with OBS? If you don't mind I would ask you another question. For multiple days I have tried to solve my laggy gaming performance. Watched multiple youtube videos about this but I cannot solve it. Here's my log:

For example it says I need to turn off HAGS even though I had turned it off before and have restarted my computer at least 30 times since then...

Your "Digitale Audioschnittstelle (2- Game Capture HD60 S+)" (german OBS?) says for instance initialized by 48k, later the "Video Capture Device" (HD60 S+ too) ist listed with 44k1 on the other hand. Then your "Mikrofon-/AUX-Audio" is listed as monitoring (monitor+output). So if you are sampling desktop audio too it could mean a loop.

As your former description in the first post describes you feeled a "metallic" kind of noise. Sounds for me strongly like a doubled (and just milliseconds from each other apart) track. Comb filtering (Kammfilter in german) very often sounds "metallic". So please try if setting your mic to output only (no monitoring) helps regarding this?
 
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